Bob Juch's Kin

Ancestors of Robert Erwin William Juch

Thirty-Second Generation

(Continued)

They had the following children:

	M	i	Ordulf of Saxony was born about 1022 in Saxony. He died 28 Mar 1072.
	F	ii	Ida Billung was born about 1024 in Saxony, Germany. She died in Namur, Belgium.
	M	iii	Hermann of Saxony was born about 1026. He died 31 May 1086.
1221166323	F	iv	Gertrud Princess of Saxony was born about 1028 and died 4 Aug 1113.

They had the following children:

1221166324	M	i	Amadeo II Count of Savoy was born about 1040 and died 26 Jan 1080.
	M	ii	Pietro de Maurienne was born about 1042 in Savoie, France. He died 1078.
	F	iii	Bertha de Savoy was born 21 Sep 1051 in Maurienne, France. She died 27 Dec 1087.

They had the following children:

1221166325

F

i

Joan de Geneva was born about 1040.

They had the following children:

1221166600	M	i	Roger I "The Spainard" de Toeni was born 990 and died 1038.
	F	ii	Adele de Toeni was born about 1004 in Normandy, France. She died 1051. Said by some to be the widow, not the sister of Roger. This is not possible as Roger did not die until 1038.
	M	iii	Robert de Toeni Baron of Belvoir was born 1014 in St. Saveur, Normandy, France. He died 4 Aug 1088 in Belvoir Castle, Leicestershire, England. Belvoir: The Heirs of Robert and Berengar de Tosny. Taken from website http://www.ihrinfo.ac.uk/ihr/nine.html. K. S. B. Keats-Rohan. Succession to the fee of Belvoir has been discussed as a problem several times over the years, but perhaps the issue is actually straightforward once one has identified the key players.1 Domesday's Robert de Tosny of Belvoir was a collateral of his contemporaries Ralph and Roger. By c. 1050+ he had a first-born son Berengar who could expect to succeed his father in Normandy.2 Around the time of Domesday Book, a few years before his death, Robert founded Belvoir priory with his wife Adelais. Early charters of Belvoir mention their sons William and Geoffrey and their daughter Agnes.3 At his death, Robert's lands were divided between Berengar, his eldest son and Norman heir - co-incidentally an English tenant-in-chief in his own right - and his next son and English heir, William. Presumably some provision was made for the third son Geoffrey. As it happened, all three sons were to die without issue, which meant that rights of succession passed to Robert's daughters. Initially, the sole right of succession passed to Robert's eldest daughter Albreda, who inherited the tenancies-in-chief of both her eldest brother Berengar and her younger brother William before the date of the Lindsey Survey, which shows her husband Robert de Insula in charge of both honours.4 It has always been assumed that Albreda was the widow of Berengar who took his land to a second husband, but the idea is clearly untenable once the full story of the Belvoir succession unfolds. The references in confirmation charters of the Lincolnshire abbey of Newhouse to 'the fee of Albreda de Tosny'' is an indication that the wife of Robert de Insula was a blood relative and heiress of Berengar, rather than his widow.5 This view is confirmed by the necrology of Belvoir priory, where the anniversaries of Berengar and Albreda uxor eius, deo sancta (a phrase always referring to a religious in this document) were kept on 29 June.6 All doubt is removed by a charter of c. 1147/52 in which Hugh Bigod made a grant to Kirkstall abbey for the soul of Albrede de Insula amite mee, a phrase that can only mean that Albreda was his mother's sister.7 The phrase also usefully confirms that Albreda de Tosny and Albreda (wife of Robert) de Insula were the same. Robert de Tosny had two other daughters, of whom the youngest was Agnes. She confirmed her father's grant of land at Aslackby, Lincolnshire, to Belvoir priory as being part of her marriage portion on her first marriage to Ralph de Beaufour of Hockering (fl. 1086/1100).8 Widowed in the early twelfth century, she married secondly Hubert I de Ryes, castellan of Norwich, to whom the tenancy-in-chief of Hockering was given by Henry I. She occurs in the 1129/30 Pipe Roll (p. 93) charged with a debt of 35 silver marks because her son was with the count of Flanders. At a similar date she attested the charter which William de Albini pincerna gave for Wymondham priory on the day his wife Matilda Bigod, Agnes's niece, died. Agnes follows her sister Adelisa Bigod in the witness list, where she was accompanied by her daughter Almud and a niece or granddaughter (nepta) Muriel.9 Her dower lands at Aslackby and at Seaton, Northamptonshire (then in Rutland), were held in 1166 by her son or grandson Ralph de Beaufour from her grandson Hubert II de Ryes.10 The elder of Robert de Tosny's younger daughters was Adelisa, wife of Roger Bigod at his death in 1107. It is probable that Roger was married only once, although he is usually credited with two wives of the same name on the inconclusive evidence of a pro anama clause in a charter of his son William.11 Roger and his wife Adelisa gave charter for Rochester priory which referred to their sons and daughters and was attested by their children William, Humphrey, Gunnor and Matilda.12 This charter tellingly refers to King Henry, making it highly unlikely that Roger acquired a second wife and second family before his death in 1107. It is likely that Rogers' children were born from the late 1090s onwards, and that the youngest of them were Hugh and Cecilia.13 Roger's daughters Gunnor and Matilda were married soon after 1107. Gunnor's marriage to Robert fitz Swein of Essex had perhaps been arranged by her father. Matilda was married to William de Albini pincerna by Henry I who bestowed 10 Bigod fees on her as a marriage portion. The marriages certainly took place before Adelisa de Tosny became the heiress to Belvoir on the death without issue of her eldest sister Albreda, some time between 1115/18 and 1129, when Adelisa, as widow of Roger Bigod, accounted for her father's land of Belvoir.14 In 1129 the sole surviving issue of Robert de Tosny were his younger daughters Adelisa Bigod and Agnes de Beaufour, who was then already married to Hubert de Ryes. At that date his Bigod granddaughter Matilda de Albini was probably already dead and her sister Gunnor not long removed from her second marriage to Haimo de St Clair. Of their siblings, only Hugh Bigod and Cecilia, then wife of William de Albini Brito, survived. The Carta returned by Hugh Bigod in 1166 shows him holding the fee of his aunt Albreda de Insula.15 At the same date William de Albini Brito II held the fee of Belvoir. The conclusion from this must be that Adelisa succeeded Albreda in the fees of both Berengar and Robert de Tosny as next surviving sister. When she in her turn died she left issue of both sexes. Her sole surviving son Hugh succeeded his aunt Albreda - and by extension, her eldest brother Berengar - as heir both to Berengar's tenancy-in-chief in Lincolnshire and the Norman lands of Robert de Tosny of Belvoir. His tenancy of Robert's Norman lands is shown in a Norman record of 1172 where he is named as holding land of the fee of Conches and Tosny.16 More important in terms of size in England, the lordship of Belvoir was nonetheless the lesser of the two Tosny lordships because it as not associated with their Norman heritage. As the inheritance of a woman married to an important tenant-in-chief it could be expected to pass to one of her younger children and not her husband's principal male heir. Since she had no surviving younger sons after 1120, the devolution of Belvoir to one of her daughters was inevitable. Gunnor and Matilda had long since been provided for from their father's inheritance by the time, after c. 1115/1118, that Adelisa succeeded to Belvoir. Consequently it was the youngest daughter Cecilia - quite probably a mere infant at her father's death in 1107 - who became her mother's heiress. She was, of course , an heiress whose marriage could advantageously be used to reward one of the king's loyal new men. Cecilia's marriage to William de Albini Brito has been said to have occurred as early as 1107 on the basis of a Belvoir charter given by Ralph de Raines and attested by Roger Bigod, but it certainly took place much later. The Belvoir charter just mentioned probably begins to the early 1140s . It was attested by William de Albini senior and his wife Cecilia, their son William junior, Roger Bigot, Robert de Toteneio, Ralph de Albeneio and others.17 Since William, Robert and Ralph were certainly sons of William and Cecilia it is clear that Roger Bigod was also, as is confirmed by the order of their sons William, Robert, Roger, listed in the Thorney Liber vitae (BL Add, 40,000, fol. 2r) The prosopography of Domesday Book which is part of the COEL research project will be published later this year by Boydell and Brewer as Domesday People: A Prosopography of Persons Occurring in English Documents 1066-1166. Volume I. Domesday Book. It is hoped that the COEL database will be published in November/December. Final details are still to be decided, but a network copy will probably cost around Ãii600. A few screen shottttts frommm theeeee database are available on the Unit website, http;://www.linacre.ox.ac.uk/prosop/home.stm (or, if that proves troublesome, www.linacre.ox.ac.uk, then click on Unit). Inquiries can be sent be e-mail to katherine.keats-rohan@linacre.ox.ac.uk Footnotes 1 Cf. J. Green, Government of England Under Henry I, 228-9. 2 Named after his father's brother Berengar Spina, all three occur in a Marmoutier charter of 1063, when Berengar , probably then still an adolescent, authorised an agreement made by his father (Faroux, Recueil...de Normandie, 157). 3 Mon. Ang. ii, 288-9. 4 Lindsey Survey (Lincoln Record Soc. Vol. 19) L3/8, 4/3, 6/5, 7/5, 10/1. 5 Stenton, Danelaw Charters, nos. 238-9. 6 BL Add. 4936, fol. 27. 7 Coucher Book of Kirkstall (Thoresby Soc. Vol. 8, 1904), no. cclxvi, pp. 188-9. 8 Mon. Ang. ii, 290, no. vii. 9 Mon. Ang. iii, 330-1. 10 RBE, 401. 11 Mon. Ang. iii, 330-1. 12 BL Cotton Domitian A x, fol. 201v-2r. 13 The view that all his children were minors at his death in 1107 was expressed in A. Wareham,'Motives and politics of the Bigod family c.1066-1177', Anglo-Norman Studies 17 (1995). 14 Pipe Roll 31 Henry I, 114. 15 RBE 397. 16 At Guerney and Vesley, Eure, cant. Gisors; RBE, 642; cf. Loyd, Anglo-Norman Families, 74. 17 Mon. Ang. ii, 289, no. 111.

They had the following children:

1221166604

M

i

Siward Bjornsson was born 997 and died 1055.

They had the following children:

1221166605

F

i

AEfleda III was born 997.

2442333214. Robert I "The Magnificent" 6th Duke of Normandy is printed as #1221167112.

2442333215. Hariette de Falaise Officer of the Household is printed as #1221165863.

They had the following children:

	M	i	William I "The Conqueror" King of England was born 14 Oct 1024 in Falaise, Normandy, France. He died 9 Sep 1087 in Priory of St. Gervais, Rouen, France. Reigned 1066-1087. Duke of Normandy 1035-1087. Invaded England defeated and killed his rival Harold at the Battle of Hastings and became King. The Norman conquest of England was completed by 1072 aided by the establishment of feudalism under which his followers were granted land in return for pledges of service and loyalty. As King William was noted for his efficient if harsh rule. His administration relied upon Norman and other foreign personnel especially Lanfranc Archbishop of Canterbury. In 1085 started Domesday Book.
1221166607	F	ii	Adeliza of Normandy Countess of Aumale was born 1029 and died before 1090.

2442333220. Ralph de Quesnay is printed as #471868170.

2442333221. Maud de Wateville is printed as #471868171.

Ralph and Maud had the following children:

1221166610	M	i	William de Chesney Sheriff of Norfolk was born 1070.
	F	ii	Sibil de Chesney was born 1083 in Street, Sussex, England. She was buried in Sussex, England.

They had the following children:

1221166622

M

i

Robert II d'Oyley 3rd Lord of Hooknorton was born about 1075 and died 1142.

He had the following children:

1221166623	F	i	Edith FitzForne was born about 1072 and died 1152.
	M	ii	Ivo Lord of Greystoke 1 was born about 1085 in Greystoke, Cumberland, England. He died 1156. Ivo was father of Walter. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd, London, 1883, p. 254, Greystock, Barons Greystock]

2442333248. Walter (Gautier) II "The White" de Valois Count of Vexin is printed as #1221165832.

2442333249. Adele de Senlis is printed as #1221165833.

They had the following children:

	F	i	Alix de Vexin was born 970 in Mellent, Normandy, France.
1221166624	M	ii	Walter "Dreux" de Vexin Count of Mantes and the Vexin was born 979 and died 1 Jul 1035.
	M	iii	Count Raoul II de Vexin was born 980 in Vexin, Normandy, France. He died 1030.

2442333250. AEthelred II "The Unready" King of England is printed as #1221165870.

They had the following children:

	M	i	St. Edward "The Confessor" King of England 1 was born about 1005 in Islip, Oxfordshire, England. He died 5 Jan 1065/1066 in London, Middlesex, England and was buried in Westminster Abbbey, London, England. Known as "the Confessor", he was born around c. 1003/4 (by 1005) at Islip, Oxon. When he succeeded his half-brother King Hartacanute, on the 8th of June, 1042, the crown of England reverted from the usurping Dainsh dynasty to the line of Cerdic once more, and for the last tiem. Edward was crowned on the 3rd of April, 1043, at Winchester Cathedral. He died on the 4th or 5th of January, 1066, at the Palace of Westminster, and was buried in the new Westminster Abbey, built by his command and only recently consecrated. He was succeeded by Harold, Earl of Wessex, his brother-in-law, to whom he left his throne, with the suport of the Witan, there being no adult claimant to the crown of the line of Cerdic. Edward and Edith's marriage was purely platonic, the King being unwilling, for religious reasons, to comsummate it, hense there were no children. His talent lay in the building of churches. On the 7th of February, 1161, edward the Confessor was canonised, thus becoming the only king of England to be made a saint.
1221166625	F	ii	Goda (Godgifu) Princess of England was born about 1009 and died before 1056.
	M	iii	Alfred Athling was born before 1012. He died 5 Feb 1036/1037 in Ely, Cambridgeshire, England.

He had the following children:

1221166734

M

i

Alberic de Vere was born about 1030 and died 1088.

Hubert and his spouse had the following children:

1221166794

M

i

Eudo de Rie was born about 1055 and died after 12 Jul 1080.

2442333590. Richard FitzGilbert de Clare is printed as #624960596.

2442333591. Rohese Giffard is printed as #624960597.

Richard and Rohese had the following children:

	M	i	Walter de Clare Lord of Nether Gwent was born 1056/1083. He died 10 Mar 1136/1137.
	M	ii	Roger FitzRichard de Clare was born 1056/1083. He died 1130.
	M	iii	Richard FitzRichard de Clare Abbot of Ely was born 1056/1083. He died 1100.
	M	iv	Robert FitzRichard de Clare Baron of Baynard was born 1056/1083. He died 1136.
1221166795	F	v	Rohese FitzRichard de Clare was born about 1055 and died 1121.
	M	vi	Gilbert FitzRichard de Clare Earl Hertford 1, 2 was born 3 before 1066 in Clare, Suffolk, England. He died 3, 4 before 1117. Heir in England; granted Cardigan in Wales. Lord of Tunbridge, founded Priory of Clare, Lord of Cardigan Gilbert de Tonebruge, who resided at Tonebruge and inherited all his father's lands in England, joined in the rebellion of Robert de Mowbray, Earl of Northumberland, but observing the king (William Rufus) upon the point of falling into an ambuscade, he relented, sought pardon, and saved his royal master. We find him subsequently, however, again in rebellion in the same reign and fortifying and losing his castle at Tunbridge. Hem. In 1113, Adeliza, dau. of the Earl of Cleremont, and had issue, Richard, his successor, Gilbert, Walter, Hervey, and Baldwin. Gilbert de Tonebruge, who was a munificent benefactor to the church, was s. by his eldest son, Richard de Clare. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, London, 1883, p. 119, Clare, Lords of Clare, Earls of Hertford, Earls of Gloucester] Gilbert m. Adeliza, dau, of the Earl of Claremont, and was father of Richard de Clare, Earl of Hertford, and Gilbert de Clare, created Earl of Pembroke. [Sir Bernard Burke, Dormant, Abeyant, Forfeited and Extinct Peerages, Burke's Peerage, Ltd., London, England, 1883, p. 230, Giffard, Earls of Buckingham]

2442333632. Thurstan le Goz Lord of Heismes is printed as #1221165860.

He had the following children:

	M	i	Richard le Goz Viscount of Avranches was born about 1025 in Avranches, Normandy, France. He died 1066.
1221166816	M	ii	Robert Bigod was born 1015 and died 1071.

2442333636. Ralph II de Toeni is printed as #2442333200.

2442333637. de Bayeaux is printed as #2442333201.

They had the following children:

	M	i	Roger I "The Spainard" de Toeni was born 990 in Tosni, Normandy, France. He died 1038 in Normandy, France.
	F	ii	Adele de Toeni was born about 1004 in Normandy, France. She died 1051. Said by some to be the widow, not the sister of Roger. This is not possible as Roger did not die until 1038.
1221166818	M	iii	Robert de Toeni Baron of Belvoir was born 1014 and died 4 Aug 1088.

2442333752. Ralph de Sudeley Earl of Hereford is printed as #610583312.

They had the following children:

1221166876

M

i

Ralph de Gael Earl of Norfolk, Suffolk and Cambridge was born about 1042 and died 1096.

They had the following children:

1221166877

F

i

Emma FitzOsbern was born about 1059 and died after 1095.

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